France to fine women with full-face Islamic veils


The French government decided Wednesday to impose a $185 fine on women who wear a full-face Islamic veil in public, pushing ahead with a controversial ban despite signs of tension between France’s Muslims and the Christian-tradition majority.

President Nicolas Sarkozy said his government was forwarding the legislation to parliament because it had a “moral responsibility” to uphold traditional European values in the face of an increasingly visible Muslim population, estimated at more than 5 million, the largest in Western Europe. He called the course chosen by his government “demanding” but “just,” and he said the law was not intended to stigmatize Muslims.

France is one of several Western European countries seeking to forbid the full-face veil, called the burqa in Afghanistan and the niqab in North Africa. Belgium’s Chamber of Representatives last month approved a nationwide ban, which must now be considered by the Senate. Legislators in several other countries have introduced similar bills, and the Swiss government has vowed to impose a ban administratively.

The French proposal has drawn heavy support, with up to 60 percent of those questioned in opinion polls saying restraints are necessary. But Muslims here have complained that they feel singled out for a practice that, according to an Interior Ministry estimate, concerns fewer than 2,000 women in a country of 64 million inhabitants.

The tensions boiled over Tuesday evening during a debate on the law in a Paris suburb with a large Muslim population. Members of the pro-Palestinian Sheik Yassin Movement tried to shout down the speakers, and scuffles broke out, leading to intervention by police officers who were called in by the organizers.

Last week, a woman wearing a full veil filed a legal complaint against a lawyer who she said insulted her religion in the Atlantic Coast town of Saint-Nazaire, according to local media reports. The lawyer, also a woman, filed a counter-complaint, alleging she was beaten by the veil-wearing woman, the reports said.

Mohammed Moussaoui, head of the government-approved French Council for the Muslim Religion, said recently that 15 mosques have been defaced since the beginning of the year and that Muslim tombs in two cemeteries have been vandalized. In addition, a halal butcher shop was sprayed with automatic weapons fire in Marseille, he said.

The French legislation approved by the full cabinet is scheduled to come to a vote in the National Assembly in July and in the Senate in September. Sarkozy’s conservative coalition has comfortable majorities in both houses.

The measure was expected to draw support from some political figures in the Socialist opposition as well, although the Socialist hierarchy has called for narrower legislation. A resolution condemning the full veil as contrary to the values of the French republic passed with an overwhelming majority last week.

The Constitutional Council, France’s highest constitutional court, has issued two opinions warning that the full public ban will be vulnerable to challenge in the courts as an infringement on religious freedom. It also could be challenged in the European Court of Human Rights, the council said. But Sarkozy vowed to move forward anyway, saying the government will have to deal with legal challenges as they arise.

After six months of what officials described as “pedagogy” to educate the public after the expected Senate approval, the new law would go into effect about a year from now. It would give police the right to demand that women lift their veils to identify themselves. If they refused, police could hold them for up to four hours for an identity check. If cited for wearing the veil, women would be referred to a prosecutor, who could fine them, force them to attend “citizenship classes” or both. Washington Post

Discussion

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  • Fadi Abboud

    Well.. i am not sure how i feel about this . But on the other hand, women in Arab countries are forced to wear the veils even if they are no Muslim.
    Whats wrong with non Arab countries doing the reverse?

  • moustapha

    No that is not what is happening hear Fadi. I am Muslim and I am for this law. Wearing the veil is just a form of dressing it identifies you as a modest and conservative person who doesn’t choose to exploit or showoff their sexuality. It doesnt neccessarily mean that there is no beauty in wearing modestly.

    But Wearing from head to toe is not a dress code, it is an identity eraser and something that is abnormal. I as a Muslim find myself uncomfortable around someone who i can not put a face to the voice, nor can i hear the voice clearly. It is just completely illogical wearing from head to toe without knowing if this person is man or woman.

    Saudi is far from a true Islamic country.. very very far. If their people agree with their governments law that is their prerogative, but it is also France’s right to also make laws that uphold basic human rights.

    No where in Islam does it say Erase your Identity, it does the opposite.. It says take a stance make an identity but don’t base it off of sexuality.. base it off of the way you deal with the people around you, your intellectuality, passion for what you make a living with and your success in bettering your self and making a positive impact on your community.

    Peace

  • Elias D

    Well said Moustapha! you’re a wiseman Bro.

  • moustapha

    Wow Elias.. That is very kind of you! Believe me.. I learn more then I give. And so your words are humbling. Allahy waf2ak.

    Peace

  • maria

    Bravo France! I hope all countries follow your law against the veil. When you goto saudi, women have to follow their rules so I think its only fair that you follow the rules of each country.

    Moustapha….excellent point of view! You definately are wise and intelligent!

  • jaerth

    If you want to live in someone eles contry you should follow the law, or your other choice is to pick up your ass and live, thats what I will do.

  • Susie

    I have mixed views on this issue.
    1) France should be allowed to make its rules. When in Rome do like the Romans do, right? Just like when in Saudi (as many of you have pointed out), we do like the Saudis.
    2) France is NOT Saudi. France stands for freedom and equality. However, they are saying that we should all dress the same. Just because someone dresses in their cultural dress code, then it is too different for them to tolerate. So France cannot claim to be a free country if they impose a dresscode on its people.

    I’ve spoken to many French about this and they are vehement that they do not want to talk to someone who does not show their face. They say, “what are they hiding”? and even “I have a right to see the person I am talking to, why am I not good enough to see this person”? And of course, “France is an equal country, so why should women be degraded to dress like that, when men are free to dress the way they want”.

    Being Lebanese (although not muslim), I always feel the obligation to come to the defense of these women, with reasons such as “A woman dressed in slutty clothes is offensive to me,but she is allowed to dress slutty” & “She chooses to dress the way she wants, she isn’t forced by her husband to dress like that” and “muslims don’t tell you how to live your religion, so you don’t tell them how to live theirs”.

    Note in the UK that people are not allowed to wear hats or caps or hoods in public areas like train stations, so that any criminal act is caught. IN the same way, people fear a terrorist dressed as an innocent religious lady could blow up a place.

    After reading some comments from muslims, maybe I am wrong. Is the burqua nowhere to be seen in the Koran? Did it really come about from men who wanted to hide their wives and erase their identities? If so, strangely I still think that it should be a person’s decision how they want to dress: in underwear or in burqua. But there should be a mechanism to stop men or anyone from forcing others to dress a certain way.

  • moustapha

    You make great points Susie. But i think i have some points to add which kinda keeps the debate open.

    Now, is there a country in this world that you are allowed to walk freely naked? I don’t know of a place that is an established country that allows that. So that extreme is not allowed, thus I believe the opposite shouldn’t be either. The Burqa is a complete extreme of the hijab.

    I’d like to point out to everyone.. that muslim men have just as a hard time as muslim women. there are many muslim men who feel they want to enjoy more of life and will have to stop alot of those things because their wives want to commit to the hijab.

    The hijab is not a burden, its a protection the women chooses to adopt. Non of my sisters, mom, nor my wife wears the hijab(Allah yihdeena jami3an..love my girls!!).
    My wife intends to some day in the future when she feels ready.. and quite frankly I want to experience much that I haven’t because i thought i would be patient and share those experiences with the one I want to share the rest of my life with. But.. if my wife decides to wear the hijab earlier then I expect, i will support her all the way.
    But know that it will be as hard on me as on her. Most people don’t see the dynamic of Hijab on the significant other and it is important to understand how hard it is on muslim men to be supportive of the hijab.

    God bless.

    Peace

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